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Post by rachel4 on Feb 15, 2012 14:49:43 GMT -5
I'm not sure where to put this thread so I guess this is as good a place as any. My question....(and I'm a Southern Baptist, so this is not a slam against the SBC)...
I've been told recently that the history of the SBC is Calvinism. I've been a member of various SBC churches for about 20 years and never heard of this before moving close to Louisville, home of Southern Seminary, which seems to be pushing this on their students.
Anybody have any info on this, background/history for me? I'm not well versed enough to say one way or the other.
Thanks, Sister Rachel
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Post by JohnMark on Feb 18, 2012 20:09:26 GMT -5
A lot of Baptists were calvinistic in the 1800s, Southern Baptists included. As the SBC was created in 1845 a lot of them had calvinistic leanings. Even so, not all were. J.R. Graves, who was probably one of their greatest theologians believed in once saved always saved but was not calvinistic. It all depends on who you check out as to what you find out.
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Post by Brother Ben on Feb 20, 2012 10:06:33 GMT -5
As I have stated before, early Baptists, (starting from the mid to late 1600's on,) were either Calvinsit or Arminian. When the Puritans could make no more progress "purifying the Church of England, some, seeing the example of the "anabaptists" of Holland, Germany, and Switzerland, took a more biblical, 1st Century approach to the church model, and started the Baptists as we know them today.
Some, however, did not agree with the Calvinsitic views on doctrine, and started "Baptist" churches that were more Arminian in their theology. Those that held to the Calvinistic tenants were called "Particular Baptist," believing in Particular Redemption based on "election." Those on the Arminian side were called "General Baptists," believing in a general redemption.
The Baptist of early America were usually either/or when it came to their doctrinal persuasion. Eventually, there arose churches that were made up of those of both groups who saw a need to work together and have a more balanced perspective on these doctrines. This I think is biblical and was a good move.
With the coming of the Civil War, there was a split in the growing Baptist movement in America and that is one of the reasons for the formation of the SBC. Then as now, some did not agree on the more centralized form of doctrine and tended to lean toward Calvinism or Arminianism. There have always been more Calvinistic SBC preachers and churches. We have seen a resurgence of this with (good) men like Paul Washer.
Calvinism, as a doctrine is not so bad as long as one does not let it go to their head. It can and many times does affect evangelism and genders strife amongst brethren, as can Arminianism, too. Both fall under the realm of "orthodox" theology, that is to say, one is not a "heretic" for believing either, but a divisive spirit can arise as those with "stronger heads" view and often condemn the "other side," as heretics, apostates, etc.
The key to this issue is humility. The fact of the matter is, the 1st Century church was neither/nor when it comes to these doctrines. Some like to "read it into" the early church father quotes, but the church was more pure and free from these doctrines. Humility will cause us to see those who are resting in the finished work of Christ on Calvary as "brethren," and we will do as the scripture says and love them accordingly.
It is a good day when brethren of "opposing" views can sit down, have a hardy scriptural discussion on such matters, slap their leg and declare, "Imagine that, God has produced a book so shallow, the children can safely wade in it, and so deep, we can't reach it's bottom!" And then embrace each other in brotherly love, and go on serving Christ.
The story is told of John Wesley and some of his followers at the funeral of George Whitfield. The two had disagreed on theology, Whitfield being Calvinist, and Wesley being Arminian. At the funeral, one of Wesley's followers asked, "Master Wesley, will we see Master Whitfield in heaven?" implying perhaps in his Calvinism he was not saved. Wisely, Wesley answered, "Oh no, I think not." Surely his followers thought he was confirming thier suspicions. Then Wesley went on to say, "Bro. George will be so far ahead of us, close to the Throne of God, that we will never get close enough to see him!"
Good answer.
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